News, views & chat from the people of West London
Hillingdon, 
London Borough, News, Pictures, Chat
truth
MAIN INDEX | PHOTOS | HAYES | UXBRIDGE
+ + Check out the LATEST photos! + + JOIN THE DEBATES + + IT'S GOOD TO TALK! + +
WELCOME

It is currently Mon Oct 05, 2026 6:51 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 4 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:37 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:14 pm
Posts: 659
The UK Govt says he must go. Following an appeal, the UK's highest Court ruled in favour of the Govt and also said he must go - but the European court says he must stay.

The Abu Qatada question shows that the UK have now limited powers to protect it's people. It's an absolute outrage that our own Courts cannot decide important matters of national security

He remains in custody following a raid on his house where he was found to be allegedly breaching the conditions of his bail. The details of the breach have not been made public but in time the nature of the breach will show a complete disregard to the UK's law and the restrictions placed upon him by such a Court.

It wont be long before he claims £1000s or millions in compensation under some human rights clause, as many other terrorist suspects have done. These men are now very rich (less the huge sums sent to training camps in Pakistan). So due to the impotence of the UK Courts bought about by the Euro Courts, the UK pay out and subsidise terrorist groups. You just couldn't make it up!

What a cock up! I wonder what the penalty would be if the UK just bundled him up and took him to Jordan? It might be cheaper (and safer) than keeping this guy here


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ges-jailed


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:06 pm
Posts: 1307
Hows about this for a persuasive view from another direction.

Not my work but a piece I can wholly sympathise with.

Quote:
The whole purpose of Human Rights is to protect unpopular and nasty little people that the public either through spontaneous or, more commonly, manufactured dislike, find obnoxious and who, if left to their own devices would treat more oppressively than those who are regarded universally popular or more deserving of our goodwill.

The difficulty we have is that the information we receive as individuals which allow us to arrive at an informed opinion is managed and promulgated by those whose political and commercial existence is determined by the wishes of that same majority.

Thus, newspaper editors will not lend support to unpopular minorities since to do so will alienate their readership and impact upon their profit margin. Politicians will not openly support minorities deemed unpopular with the electorate since to do so has obvious consequences at the ballot box. Often, it will be the Kelvin Mackenzie's of this world who will determine who is or is not flavour of the months and go to print on it from which the political establishment will respond to what they perceive to be the popular will as measured in the editorial section of the Mail or the Sun.

In other words, your view of the world and those who inhabit it is determined by those who have the monopoly on the information you are permitted to receive to arrive at an independent or directed perception of others.

I realise I am labouring the blindingly obvious and I mean no disrespect in feeling it necessary to do so but it is important to realise that no government of whatever colour has any right to demand that its citizens trust it or to believe that it always tells the truth. Those who choose to do so in blind faith in its motives and good intentions run the risk of being led blindfold straight to the slaughterhouse!

That Mr Qatada has succeeded in his appeal is, in my view, an indication that we have a judiciary that is willing and able to assert its independent status within the realm against a government that has mobilised every resource at its disposal to rid itself of someone it does not like, against whom it has no evidence of criminal behaviour in this country who has been deprived of his freedom by the state for no other reason than he says things the government does not like and who fears that others may agree with him. With the enormous and extensive coercive powers of the criminal law at its disposal the government has not found a single suitable charge upon which to arraign him before a court of competent jurisdiction to face trial by his peers.

It demonstrate to me that if the aim of people like him is to subvert our democracy by goading weak politicians into ever increasing acts of legislative authoritarianism in the mistaken belief of accruing some electoral advantage by 'doing what the people elect them for' then he will have done more than Philip of Spain, Napoleon and Hitler combined. That the court has been able to protect people like him says a great deal more about the values professed rather than practiced by those we elect.

Human rights are for the protection of the individual against the might of the state. Whatever the state has to say about Human Rights is usually in its capacity of a serial offender who complains of his treatment at the hands of those task it is to adjudicate on them. It follows that whatever complaints are uttered by a Prime Minister or a Secretary of State as a result of an adverse judgment have no greater weight, force or credibility than that of the common offender who leaves the court complaining of the severity of his sentence.


I neither like nor loathe Qatada but is he really any less entitled to the protection of the court for his obnoxious views than that of Arthur Refearn whose rights to hold obnoxious racist views was protected last year?

This judgement delivered by the same ECHR many will find interesting....http://www.bailii.org/eu/cases/ECHR/2012/1878.html


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:42 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:14 pm
Posts: 659
geezer466 wrote:
......... against whom it has no evidence of criminal behaviour in this country who has been deprived of his freedom by the state for no other reason than he says things the government does not like .........[/url]


Therein lies the problem. Due to numerous miscarriages of justice and resulting legislation that has arisen from those events, we are now in a position where the tests required for evidence to be admissible in a UK Court are perhaps amongst the most onerous in the world. I believe that the reasons the Govt want AH out are far more complicated than they dont like what he says. That's a rather naive view and if true, Bob Crow would most certainly be on the next flight out of the UK. :roll:

I believe that there are many undesirables in the UK which the Govt are aware of but don't have any or enough evidence to convict or deport. I would hate to think that any democratic Govt could move or deport somebody on a whim, but perhaps we need to be a little tougher to protect the human rights of the majority over the rights of one individual (rather than the other way around)

A senior Met Officer attached to counter terrorism revealed that an attack as big a 7/7 has been thwarted almost every year since that bloody outrage. The vast majority - if not all of them - were organised by home grown radical Muslims, wound up and manipulated by people like AH. He may not have blood on his hands, but his prints are all over the trigger


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:06 pm
Posts: 1307
There exists in one of the terrorism acts (2000 version I think) the power to arrest and charge any person where evidence exists that that person has contrived in terrorist acts ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD.

They could easily charge Qatada with this but would need to present the evidence from Jordan in order to convict. Of course the British courts would throw out such evidence as it was obtained under torture so it serves no purpose.
Any other evidence they may have they are not so keen to put on display as it would betray some of the methods they use for gathering it.

Maybe there is a case for engineering something like dissident republicanism? This quasi shadowy force in touch with the republican leadership often carries out some rather 'dirty jobs' which are often condemned later by this same leadership even when the dirty jobs fit their own agenda.

Our best hope is to for an extremest from the EDL or BNP to slot him on his doorstep early one morning as they will never ever be able to extradite him within the law.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 4 posts ] 

All times are UTC + 1 hour [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  




LOCAL RESIDENTS AND BUSINESS: YOU CAN ADVERTISE TOTALLY FREE OF CHARGE IN OUR ADS SECTIONS!!

ARTICLES WANTED, ARTICLES FOR SALE, PLUMBERS, PIZZAS, ELECTRICIANS, ESTATE AGENTS, ACCOMMODATION WANTED OR FOR RENT, FLATS, ROOMS, HOLIDAYS & TRAVEL, JOBS AGENCIES, TRADESMEN & WOMEN, MOTORS, DRIVING LESSONS, HGV TRAINING, VOLUNTARY GROUPS... JUST REGISTER AND POST YOUR FREE AD, IT'S THAT SIMPLE. NO CATCH! TELL YOUR FRIENDS.

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

London Borough of Hillingdon Chat - Main Index

Christmas music Merelbeke