At the end of the day it's free market capitalism, something that people on here seem quite keen on so shouldn't have a problem with it.

If only it were. But our politicians willfully wrecking or giving away or selling whole industries in pursuit of a global government agenda has nothing to do with free market economics.

There is no such thing as 'free enterprise' any more. Embark upon any form of enterprises and a deluge of bureaucratic interference immediately seeks to throttle the life out of the new business. Directives, forms, taxes, legislations, regulations, guide lines, rules, Health & Safety. The first non-free contacts a new business must have are a lawyer and an accountant, to steer a way through all the bureaucracy raining down from the EU, Westminster, and the local authority. Then the EU, Westminster, and the local authority attempt to suck the very life blood, (cash) out of the new business. There is no such thing as 'free enterprise' any more; but there is plenty of State interfering fascism on offer from the parties of Cameron, Clegg, and Miliband.

For every pound earned the State seeks to take something in the order of 80 pence or more, to spend on 'compassionate concerns'. That bureaucratic compassion has all but killed off the wealth-generating sector that the public sector relies upon to fund its so-called 'compassion'.

The biggest obstacle to free enterprise is the so called single market........
Yes the EU allows free movement of goods and trade across borders but it also enforces strict controls over what it calls protectionism.

The cost of living in say Poland or Estonia is many times less than it is in the UK. Average wages in the UK are worth a fortune to these people hence we get an influx of Polish plumbers as an example who are able to charge much less than their British counterparts. People are not stupid and will employ the tradesmen who at the end of the day will cost them less.
When you cannot get a cigarette paper between the quality of the work (and in many cases today you cannot) then it is easy to see the UK is in trouble.
Prior to the single market we were still able to export our goods all over Europe, the only difference I can see since is the paperwork at border crossings has become much more simplistic.

And it was the interfering fascist political bureaucrats at Westminster that imposed the EU on us without reference to the electorate. The Common Market referendum was no justification for what we have been saddled with. Now our political masters stand back with their hands in the air claiming the disaster they've created has nothing to do with them. It really is quite incredible.

The UK is a democracy, if you don't like the policies of the government then you vote for a different party. There are more parties than the Tories, Labour and Liberal Democrats and if people really wanted something differnt there is nothing to stop them voting someone different into government.

I disagree, the UK is a pseudo-democracy. I say that because the is very little difference in the polices of the Lib/Lac/Con parties; they all subscribe to the same basic theme. Cameron and Miliband are even beginning to openly agree with one another.

Of course we can vote for other parties, but so few do vote for them that we are stuck with Lib/Lab/Con Party. Even so, most of the alterantive parties are just as unacceptable as the Lib/Lab/Con Party.

Hmmm

My e-mail that Jon originally posted has provoked some discussion, but not as much as I had hoped. Seems most people accept that UK manufacturing cannot compete in the world, don't like the EU, and want less regulation.
I have worked in Europe (pre Thatcher era), and was amazed at high their standard of living was compared to UK.
I have sufered from the Financial regulators "light touch" reglation having seen my Equitable Life pension fund decimated. To me there is not sufficient regulation - certainly as far as the Financial Services are concerned. Just check to see who audited ELAS and (later) Lehman Brothers.
The current crisis was caused by placing too much faith in the "free market".
As an engineer I welcome the regulations which I had to adhere to which included 'Safety' and the 'Radio Frequency Interference' which meant that we did't radiate anyone and the products were fit for purpose".

Now how many of you bothered to follow the link http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-12172716 given in the first post, because that is the most frightening post.



We have all seen the huge increases in food and energy prices over the past few years. Just think of the impact of a 50% shortage of world food!

It seems to me that our politicians are ignoring this threat. In my opinion the UK should be planning for this eventuallity, by ensuring that the UK (or indeed the whole of the EU), are completly self sufficient in food, energy and water.

The Financial Services will not save us, in fact they will be trying to make as much money for themselves and not care one iota for the population as a whole.

I reckon that I personally will survive, as I have seen this coming a long time ago, and have purchased agriculture land in the far east. I will never be rich, but I will be able to feed and cloth myself from the proceeds of our little farm.
It concerns me that the majority of this country have no idea of what is going to happen to the UK within the next 20 years.

We don't want communism, nor do we deserve the current "free market" economy - both lead to ruin. We need a fair form of capitalism, (which means more regulation), but how do we structure it?

Volatility in current commodities is due to the amount various Western governments primarily the US and ours have printed into existence (so called quantitative easing) in the last few years.
The banksters had to do something with it and they speculate on these markets with it.

That said it doesn't make any thing you have said wrong. Yes the World population has increased significantly over the last couple of decades but then so has Humans ability to harness food from the ground. Huge strides in fertilizer and other growing technology has allowed the available harvest to increase therefore it follows that increased availability would lead to population increases.

Of course this 'growth' cannot go on forever, there has to be an optimum level where supply can no longer be improved over demand.

Looking at it from another perspective the last 50 years have been extraordinary in the history of the human race, over that time there has been no major (World scale) wars no epidemics which in 1918 wiped out up to 100 million people nor large scale deaths from starvation in the developed world.

This then begs the question has a corner been turned off the back of technology that can go on delivering indefinitely or are we as individuals fortunate to have been born at a time when humankind has been extraordinarily lucky?

Some say the next World wars will be fought over water, some oil who knows? What is certain is the UK is an island with an ever increasing population. In the last war we had to import significant food and material a fact not lost on Hitler and Donitz who did their utmost to threaten this (food importation) bridge with their U boats. This was the closest we came to losing that war and for a while during the battle of the Atlantic it really was on a knife edge.
I could digress here and say it was British inventions such as the Leigh light and centrimetric radar which turned the tide but that's for another time. A google of battle of the Atlantic will tell the whole story.

So yes more than any other nation in Europe the UK needs to be self sufficient in foodstuffs. Are we currently? I don't know, possibly but we certainly couldn't eat as healthily or interestingly as we currently do.

In closing I have a question. You say you have a plot of land in the Far East. If things become so bad with food shortages and the rest you travel out and begin to fend for yourself in growing your own. How will you protect that and stop the 'have nots' taking it from you?

Oldmalthouse, I have spent some time thinking over your original email to Jon; it does raise some very interesting and important questions. And some of us have commented on your email from each of our own individual perspective to some degree; and in my opinion none of us have come close to addressing the real problem.

Your are right when you indicate that primary and secondary wealth producers are undervalued, even misunderstood. Your are also right when you say that financial services cannot generate wealth on their own. It is also true to say that the primary and secondary wealth generating sectors are undervalued by most of the influential and the over-paid bureaucratic members of UK society. And it is also true to say that there is far too much politics, and far too much political interference by those who have little understanding of what they are interfering with. There are too many professional non-doers telling all the doers to do what the professional non-doers are clearly incapable of doing themselves. There is an inversion of can't-do over can-do; where the can't-do drivers hold the reigns and steer the can-do horses down a blind ally. At the same time the can't-dos insist on taking all the credit and very unreasonable rewards.

There can be little doubt to any honest observer that the UK is in serious trouble. Wherever we look in the UK it seems that the very structure of the nation is not only under threat, but in many cases is exhibiting the distinct signs of being broken; and may even be broken beyond repair. Any honest person with their eyes wide open can see that the UK has enormous problems; problems that go far beyond the purely economic.

No engineer worth his money will design and create a product using poor quality materials. A good product must be well designed, fully developed to maximum potential, manufactured from the best materials, using the best procedures and techniques, and constructed and assembled by the most able and appropriately qualified staff. In short; rubbish in = rubbish out.

It seems to me that the modern UK has become poor quality material with which to construct anything of lasting value. The traits that characterise the modern UK can be exampled by the following qualities:
Dishonesty, deceit, theft (including excessive taxation), perversion, lies (including from all political parties), murder, selfishness, pride, arrogance, hatred, tribalism, state-funded injustice, greed, laziness, adultery, promiscuity, idolatry, materialism, and many other undesirable traits. Such qualities are not only endemic within the modern UK, but are positively encouraged and rewarded by those in high office, many of whom set the example.

The fundamental question has to be: why are we in the UK in the mess we are – why do the above traits characterise the modern UK? Ask any politician that question and he/she will immediately seek to emphasise the 'failure' of the opposing parties without offering any real solution to the problem. Never the less, the question remains a valid one. The difficulty arises when a realistic solution is offered because the answer is simply unpalatable to the modern UK. Somehow we can tolerate being told the problem is economic, political, too much or too little socialism, too much or too little capitalism, globalisation, isolation, unfairness, global warming, global cooling, etc. etc.

The one answer we simply cannot accept is the concept of a blessed nation, and a cursed nation. A cursed or blessed nation brings the problem of recognising a Divinity that has the power to bless and curse.

Moses warned of national blessedness and cursedness in the Old Testament book of Deuteronomy, Chapter 28. Here are the blessings:


And here are the curses:


The first commandment we have broken is this one from Exodus Chapter 23 verse 3:
We in the UK go further than having false gods; it is officially taught that we evolved from pond-scum, and by so doing we deny the Creator, who has the power to curse or bless us according to our own disobedience.

So what is the solution to our national problem? Listen to the prophets of old who have a track-record of unbroken accuracy:

And from the Apostle Peter speaking in the book of Acts:


I shouldn't be too confident Oldmalthouse, the God who is able to curse and bless knows no boundaries.
I share your concern, but I fear the future may be even more unspleasant than most of us are prepared to consider.